Ron Paul

[Louigi Verona]

And under circumstances any "normal" citizen can turn into a criminal.

Right to the point.

Hm. Why such disbelief in human morality? In a pivot of a character that holds a person together?

Actually, this is also part of the banning - this attitude that says - we don't trust you. If we don't ban weapons you will all turn into animals shooting each other.
In reality that doesn't happen. Have more confidence in people.

[g]

Yes, something like that. I do honestly believe that banning weapons is not a solution. But I also have noticed that people that oppose this said nothing about my "criminal"-"normal citizen" argument.

It's a non-argument. There is absolutely no reason to think crime will increase if guns are banned. Criminals are criminals, they will rob you anyway. If either the attacker or the victim of a crime has a gun, the chances of someone dying is heavily increased. I would feel much safer if people would ditch guns and use katanas instead. Then at least you'd have to get close to the person you're trying to defend yourself against.

I think the "have more confidence in people" argument doesn't go too well with your "criminals will always have guns and kill people that can't defend themselves" argument.

[Rxn]

Free availability of weapons and 'circumstances [under which]
any "normal" citizen can turn into a criminal' are not related the least.

[g]

Free availability of weapons and 'circumstances [under which]
any "normal" citizen can turn into a criminal' are not related the least.

I disagree, but I don't see the relevance so I won't argue. My point is that the more powerful weapons, the more dead people. Terror balance is not a good idea, it only creates a situation where both sides are more likely to make a pre-emptive strike in the name of "self defense".

[uncloned]

I think every american citizen should be given a suitcase nuke to establish a real "balance of terror"

[Rxn]

I don't see the relevance so I won't argue.

People will always do whatever they want when they know that no-one
will find out about it or they think they won't get caught.

You can pass\abolish laws about anything until blue in the face---it won't
make any difference. Just watch the news and see for yourself.

That is the core point of the mp3 piracy problem and pretty much of any
other social issue we have on hands.

[g]

I think every american citizen should be given a suitcase nuke to establish a real "balance of terror"

Everyone in the world should have a doomsday device

You can pass\abolish laws about anything until blue in the face---it won't make any difference. Just watch the news and see for yourself.

So the liberal gun laws in the USA has nothing to do with the high number of gun-related deaths? I must be watching the wrong news.

[Louigi Verona]

mp3 piracy problem

piracy is attacking ships and killing all people on them. copying a file is not piracy - try to avoid using this propaganda term

[Louigi Verona]

So the liberal gun laws in the USA has nothing to do with the high number of gun-related deaths? I must be watching the wrong news.

You've been watching the same news but you've been making different conclusions.

Also I haven't seen a graph that shows that states that have liberal gun laws have actually more crime - but I have seen data of the opposite.

[Sam_Zen]

Everyone in the world should have a doomsday device

From a philosophical view, a very nice one.
But in reality I'm afraid it will take less time than a PC without a firewall to get infected, until the globe is blown up.

piracy is attacking ships and killing all people on them. copying a file is not piracy - try to avoid using this propaganda term

Right on Louigi. The same semantic trick as used about people 'stealing' samples, so being 'thieves'.

[g]

From a philosophical view, a very nice one. But in reality I'm afraid it will take less time than a PC without a firewall to get infected, until the globe is blown up.

Oh well, there'd be no one around to miss it anyway...  :wink:

Louigi: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_violence#Homicides_by_country

[Louigi Verona]

g: interesting data. to be honest, though, I did not see a clear dependency on the availability of weapons. The numbers are pretty random. Just look at Canada, Latvia and Belarus. An interesting set of numbers.

[g]

g: interesting data. to be honest, though, I did not see a clear dependency on the availability of weapons. The numbers are pretty random. Just look at Canada, Latvia and Belarus. An interesting set of numbers.

So the fact that USA, with the most liberal gun laws of developed countries, has a firearm homicide rate that's more than five times most other developed countries is random?

[uncloned]

No, you got it wrong, we American's are just hunting - its our God given right to hunt. Everyone in our neighborhood hunts squirrel's with a glock handgun and AK 47's ... Just ask the NRA.

[Louigi Verona]

g: interesting data. to be honest, though, I did not see a clear dependency on the availability of weapons. The numbers are pretty random. Just look at Canada, Latvia and Belarus. An interesting set of numbers.

So the fact that USA, with the most liberal gun laws of developed countries, has a firearm homicide rate that's more than five times most other developed countries is random?

I did not see any such trend. The numbers are before me - where do you see it? I don't.