they are who we thought they were....

uncloned · December 06, 2009, 22:58:50

"Wired has a story about how the site Cryptome.org leaked the price lists for 'lawful spying' activities of Yahoo and other companies, and subsequently received a DMCA takedown notice from Yahoo. The documents, however, are still posted online, and in them you can learn, for instance, that IP logs last for one year, but the original IPs used to create accounts have been kept since 1999. The contents of your Yahoo account are bought for $30 to $40 by law enforcement agencies."

http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2009/12/yahoo-spy-prices

wait until everything is in the "cloud"...

Louigi Verona · December 07, 2009, 08:44:41

Yeah, but people are still forgetting something.

There are many-many reasons why the "cloud land" is still very far away from reality - that's assuming it is possible in the first place. In non-capital cities in Russia, for example, people still have weak Internet connections. They have problems downloading large files, since traffic is expensive. Also, checking up your email, chatting and storing your docs is really not cloud computing. Cloud computing is when you "compute" - that is when you are doing something else than just reading and storing data.

And computing in the cloud... well. We can't get realtime to work like we want to on the ground - reaching for the same thing in the cloud is way too early. People still have problems running musical and video software to do things in real time like hardware can. Plus all that commercialization of software development means that most software is written poorly, code is not optimized (and kept secret) and everything is done for the purpose of making money. Which means nobody is interested in delivering a product that people would not want to upgrade from.

Checking email is cool, but people play games, do music, edit video and very often want that to be on their computer. Of course, there are things like Quake 3 online and all sorts of online games, but an online DAW? No, this is not something I would want.

uncloned · December 07, 2009, 12:44:47

Unfortunately you are wrong about cloud computing.

It already exists

http://www.hobnox.com/noxtools.902.en.html

https://www.google.com/accounts/ServiceLogin?service=writely&passive=true&nui=1&continue=http%3A%2F%2Fdocs.google.com%2F&followup=http%3A%2F%2Fdocs.google.com%2F&ltmpl=homepage&rm=false

And companies like Yahoo are selling cloud computing to businesses.

Louigi Verona · December 07, 2009, 13:33:22

I know it exists. It, however, does not exist on a global scale. Although some companies try to say that cloud computing is da shit, in reality it is not. I know whole cities which just received normal DSL Internet.

As for hobnox, those are fun tools, but making music somewhere in the cloud and then get - sorry, server take down - nah. I mean really. Who would go for that?

So my attitude now is that cloud computing is not that attractive an idea for people. The idea has been around for ages, in fact. But beyond documents it simply does not go anywhere.

Louigi Verona · December 07, 2009, 13:42:40

Yeah, and might I also add that lots of this cloud computing relies on proprietary technologies like Flash. Which, in the long run, is a grave risk.

uncloned · December 07, 2009, 13:49:51

LV

The computer is becoming a cheap appliance. Probably a part of a TV. And by being cheap not be very powerful or have much if any local storage. Very easily I can see - TV/computer for the family + a personal smartphone computer.

Home computers started as a hobbyist endeavor - now it is becoming a necessity and the race is on to simplify and cheapen it. The general public has no need to program a general purpose computer. You and I are different in our use of a computer from the general public. Most people do not need the power for DAWs or edit video. As time goes on thin clients for cloud computing become typical and general purpose computers will become very expensive and out of reach for most people.

PabloLuna · December 07, 2009, 21:22:08

Cloud computing offers a single target for those who want to put down a company.

PabloLuna · December 07, 2009, 21:26:32

The perfect dictator would copyright all dissident material and the sue and sent dissidents to jail, and he could make money after collecting fines from dissidents too. After all dissidents may not want to reveal their identity as they would fear retaliation, so dictator could copyright them and use Yahoo services to hunt down dissidents as criminals.

uncloned · December 07, 2009, 21:35:07

Quote from: "PabloLuna"Cloud computing offers a single target for those who want to put down a company.

what a way to disrupt a society... - just like taking out the electric or water.

uncloned · December 07, 2009, 21:35:36

Quote from: "PabloLuna"The perfect dictator would copyright all dissident material and the sue and sent dissidents to jail, and he could make money after collecting fines from dissidents too. After all dissidents may not want to reveal their identity as they would fear retaliation, so dictator could copyright them and use Yahoo services to hunt down dissidents as criminals.

I thought the RIAA was already doing that :-0

residentgrey · December 08, 2009, 03:58:13

uncloned have you posted all these interesting things on a blog somewhere? You and a few regulars on here post some REALLY interesting things that I don't see till I get here. KUDOS my friend!

Saga Musix · December 08, 2009, 06:25:06

QuoteCloud computing offers a single target for those who want to put down a company.

Sorry, but anything that's running "on the internet" (and that's an awful lot these days) can be brought down with one "easy single step" (don't ask me what's so easy about that, though).

Louigi Verona · December 08, 2009, 08:09:34

QuoteMost people do not need the power for DAWs or edit video.

I disagree. Although it is easy to rule out the majority as being "mediocre users", in reality i see a lot of people require lots of powerful software on their computers. They might not be musicians, but they use lots of stuff. Plus, games. Online games are cool, but they cannot eliminate desktop games.

QuoteAs time goes on thin clients for cloud computing become typical and general purpose computers will become very expensive and out of reach for most people.

Also cannot agree. It would be difficult to make computers more expensive than they are now. In fact, I think that with time it would be possible to just buy parts of a computer and build one yourself.

uncloned · December 08, 2009, 13:17:09

Quote from: "Louigi Verona"
In fact, I think that with time it would be possible to just buy parts of a computer and build one yourself.

LV - I've been doing that since the 80's...

And - most people just need email, browser, a spreadsheet and a wordprocessor

you point about games is valid but will be surmounted - all that is really needed "at home" is good graphics for gaming, now. With bigger pipes and the increased bandwidth this will be less of, if any, issue.

Louigi Verona · December 08, 2009, 13:57:33

What is your point then?