A thorough review of Ableton (music software)

[g]

There is nothing you can do in one and not in the other.

How do you play two instances of the same note at once in a piano roll? Or change the volume of a note in the middle of it, independent of other notes using the same instrument? How do you drag and drop notes in a tracker easily with sub-row precision? Of course there are differences, especially when using MIDI (such as VSTi and Hardware). I think a better description is that a piano roll is aimed at playing instruments while a tracker is aimed at cool people and playing samples.

[Louigi Verona]

How do you play two instances of the same note at once in a piano roll? Or change the volume of a note in the middle of it, independent of other notes using the same instrument?

If you'd use a piano roll you'd know there is absolutely no problem to do what you described. In fact, it is all very simple and very visual.

[Louigi Verona]

How do you drag and drop notes in a tracker easily with sub-row precision?

I may be wrong but I think MPT can do drag and drop.

[Saga Musix]

Uhm yeah, fine, you read the first part of the sentence, but not the second. sub-row precision!

[psishock]

How do you drag and drop notes in a tracker easily with sub-row precision?

the magical word is SDx.

[Louigi Verona]

Uhm yeah, fine, you read the first part of the sentence, but not the second. sub-row precision!

You are right, I missed the SUB row thing. Well, I guess this is a certain downside, although one can overcome this by changing to a larger scale.

[LPChip]

I also know people that think there isn't anything better then Ableton.

I've had some nice talks with them, and the biggest difference is the way those people want to compose music.

They do not want to enter notes or push mouseclicks. They want to press record, and play on their gear to make their songs that way.

They then just want to finetune their recordings.

In a tracker, people usually want to enter the notes themselves for optimal precision and speed. This is the entire difference why people may prefer a tracker over a sequencer (sequencers allow easier recordings from a keyboard than a tracker can, because trackers are pattern oriented, while using a sequencer often gives the possibility to record one recording for say 4 minutes, then start another one half way till the end, then another one for 30 seconds at a certain point etc... In a tracker this is far more difficult because then you actually have to plan ahead. Make empty patterns, find the sounds you want to use, Try and record it perfectly whitin a pattern so you could reuse that pattern. It comes down to the fact that everything you want to do to give the tracker's pro points to a sequencer, you loose them because there are none. The pro's become a con when you want to record using a midi keyboard.

[g]

How do you play two instances of the same note at once in a piano roll? Or change the volume of a note in the middle of it, independent of other notes using the same instrument?

If you'd use a piano roll you'd know there is absolutely no problem to do what you described. In fact, it is all very simple and very visual.

I've mostly used the FL Studio piano roll, and if it's simple and visual then please show me how. As far as I found you can only sett volume for an entire channel at any time or for individual notes only when a "note on" is sent.  

About the same note twice, it seems to work (with some Sytrus at least) I just assumed it wouldn't

[uncloned]

I also know people that think there isn't anything better then Ableton.
. In a tracker this is far more difficult because then you actually have to plan ahead. Make empty patterns, find the sounds you want to use, Try and record it perfectly whitin a pattern so you could reuse that pattern. It comes down to the fact that everything you want to do to give the tracker's pro points to a sequencer, you loose them because there are none. The pro's become a con when you want to record using a midi keyboard.

With all due respect I used to use a keyboard to enter notes in FTII

I'm pretty sure you can do that in MPT.

The key is to have a certain number of automatic skips after each note and the record one track at a time. This is IMHO the absolutely fastest way to toss in an idea if the timing is steady.

Sonar and other DAW have a similar feature.

PS I personally find entering notes on a staff the fastest for me w/o an instrument. I think it all comes down to what you are used to... and actually what you have trained yourself to think in.

[uncloned]

How do you play two instances of the same note at once in a piano roll? Or change the volume of a note in the middle of it, independent of other notes using the same instrument?

If you'd use a piano roll you'd know there is absolutely no problem to do what you described. In fact, it is all very simple and very visual.

The key here is that 1 note per channel - then with the appropriate instrument you have total control of whatever midi it responds to.

The Adlib composer, and Sonar, have a composite piano roll view.
You see all notes but only one channels is active for editing at a time. (Sonar this is actually configurable like most things...)

[Saga Musix]

How do you drag and drop notes in a tracker easily with sub-row precision?

the magical word is SDx.

And YOU, sir, missed the first part of the sentence.

[psishock]

zomg!!
*checks the first part of the sentence but cannot find it anywhere, he has missed it totally and now facing with the terrible shame, forced to walk away quietly, raggedly* :oops:

[uncloned]

Sorry, does Ableton suck on so many levels that it is just plain sad? Or is it just me?

Albeton is good for live performances because you can "launch" loops and add / delete effects interactive as the thing is playing.

But it is extremely counter intuitive to me.

You have two views - the vertical one is interactive.

The horizontal one is where you "render" the track and have it act like almost every other non-tracker DAW on the planet. The key here is you have to add a special plugin just to get the sound to come out. Its really frustrating IMHO.

[Louigi Verona]

I've mostly used the FL Studio piano roll, and if it's simple and visual then please show me how. As far as I found you can only sett volume for an entire channel at any time or for individual notes only when a "note on" is sent.

I am not sure what you mean here. Can you expand?

You can select individual notes and edit their volumes in the piano roll. You can select a group of notes and edit either their volumes as a group or edit volumes individually for each note on the group.

[Saga Musix]

I guess he means that you can't change volume on the fly, i.e. when no note is triggered at the same time.