how does modplug tracker sound?

LevonZOLTAR · June 13, 2007, 06:22:05

if you play normal wave sample in modplug tracker base note C-5 WITHOUT any resampling(also without any eq, autogain etc.). should it sound exactly the same if you play it in any DAW or soundeditor(soundforge etc.) or is there other things that effect to your sound in MPT??

KrazyKatz · June 13, 2007, 09:40:22

Fair Question. I think in addition we should ask how good a job OMPT does at converting the finished song to wav.

LPChip · June 13, 2007, 10:52:43

It really depends on the frequency the sample was recorded, and what the playback frequency of the tracker is.

If both are 44.1khz, then even with interpolation set, it will not change the sound, considered that you keep the note at being C-5.

If you have a sample recorded at 44.1 khz, while you've set the playback rate at 48khz, then there already is some form of interpolation being applied.

LevonZOLTAR · June 13, 2007, 12:28:04

thanks , i thought it would be the same.. i just wanted to know cause i make lot of sample based music. and also sometimes play my own samples , so i want them to be exactly same.

so if you use just C-5 notes(44.1khz samples) samples sound allways the same no matter what resampling mode you use??

LPChip · June 13, 2007, 12:48:33

Quote from: "LevonZOLTAR"
so if you use just C-5 notes(44.1khz samples) samples sound allways the same no matter what resampling mode you use??

Only if you also use 44.1khz for playing and exporting to wav.

Resampling makes your current sample to sound the same when there's a difference in playback rate.

So, if you make your sample play at 26khz and you have 44.1 khz playback rate, you will always have resampling going on. But if you have a sample played at 44.1 Khz, and your playback rate is also 44.1 khz, then there's no need to resample. Interpolation settings only apply when there's a resampling going on.

dBlues · June 17, 2007, 18:35:22

Every music program I ever used has a bit different sound. This has to do with anti-aliasing filters (or lack of them), bitrate, sample resolution, and in trackers, implementation of effects.

Check out Simon V's excellent site for aliasing comparisons between hosts, also features Modplug: http://www.simonv.com/tutorials/quality.php

(Modplug scored very well in this comparison)

LPChip · June 17, 2007, 21:22:54

Quote from: "dBlues"Every music program I ever used has a bit different sound. This has to do with anti-aliasing filters (or lack of them), bitrate, sample resolution, and in trackers, implementation of effects.

Check out Simon V's excellent site for aliasing comparisons between hosts, also features Modplug: http://www.simonv.com/tutorials/quality.php

(Modplug scored very well in this comparison)

This site has a bad comparison if you ask me... They used the older modplug tracker before it went open source, and not even the latest version.

OpenMPT RC2 really improved soundquality since 1.16.

Sam_Zen · June 17, 2007, 23:15:41

A program doesn't sound good or bad on its own. It depends on the skills of the user to get the best out of it.

dBlues · June 18, 2007, 15:52:25

Quote from: "LPChip"This site has a bad comparison if you ask me... They used the older modplug tracker before it went open source, and not even the latest version.

OpenMPT RC2 really improved soundquality since 1.16.

You are right, the comparison is old. But it has good instructions how to repeat the test itself (which is a good test). I would like to see the current situation measured!

dBlues · June 18, 2007, 15:55:13

Quote from: "Sam_Zen"A program doesn't sound good or bad on its own. It depends on the skills of the user to get the best out of it.

It is true that tracking is an art, which is not simple to master.

Matt Hartman · June 19, 2007, 02:15:46

Tracking is just another form of compiling sound into a syncopated form.

You know when you're getting good when you start to mold into your tool.
It's a process that every person in music eventually understands and appreciates.

Sound "quality" is subjective to the listener.

There are very few trackers/tracks I personally find entertaining. But I believe this is not because the sound is compiled via tracker, or that re sampling is the culprit. Rather, the person behind the monitor is not allowing themselves the beauty in process to mold into their tools. And though there are a lot of mechanics in the process of tracking, (as is true for traditional methods) ultimately it is purely an art form. When one understands this, one is then inclined to express without limitations.

The technical understandings of anti-aisling/re sampling are interesting. But without a platform, they are far cry from compelling.

dBlues · June 19, 2007, 18:13:06

Quote from: "Matt Hartman"Sound "quality" is subjective to the listener.

I agree that subjectiveness is a factor (e.g. whether you want headphones with silky or sharp treble depends on your listening preferences) but still the fact is, that sound quality should be seen as objectively as possible, to minimize unnecessary ear ache/bad qualities of sound. There are pitfalls in digital sound, and aliasing is definitely not the least of them..

Matt: you are right, it is the artist that should do the work in the end, not the tool. As for tracking, I feel it is quite different to any other method of putting together beautiful sounds. More special. It gives you more control, to be able to fully express what you are after. It can become a natural end of your neural system when you put your mind and heart to it. I have been tracking/recording/playing more or less for over twelve years, so I have seen some music software. That is one of the reasons why I can tell you that Modplug is a piece of art itself. It has very good sound quality, it is open and usable. But that is why further improving it is even more important. And that is also why it is relevant to discuss sound quality here.

LPChip · June 19, 2007, 19:59:12

Well... Its easy to say this I guess...

MODPlug Tracker has already got a change in sound quality, so its quite good. The only way to further improve the sound is to change the internal engine from 16 bit to 32 or 64. This change however is too much work and on top of that too complicated. (Discussed this issue a few times with the programmers)

So even though we can argue about it, its most likelly not gonna change real soon, but then again. The quality of MPT as it is now, is quite good.

32 bit can be archieved using VSTi's and leave samples unharmed, as the VST engine is 32 bit.

Saga Musix · June 19, 2007, 20:02:56

Quote from: "LPChip"Well... Its easy to say this I guess...

MODPlug Tracker has already got a change in sound quality, so its quite good. The only way to further improve the sound is to change the internal engine from 16 bit to 32 or 64. This change however is too much work and on top of that too complicated. (Discussed this issue a few times with the programmers)

So even though we can argue about it, its most likelly not gonna change real soon, but then again. The quality of MPT as it is now, is quite good.

32 bit can be archieved using VSTi's and leave samples unharmed, as the VST engine is 32 bit.

Huh? Olivier always praised ModPlug for having an internal 32bit engine! It was 32bit from the beginning...!

LPChip · June 19, 2007, 21:54:57

Quote from: "Jojo"
Quote from: "LPChip"Well... Its easy to say this I guess...

MODPlug Tracker has already got a change in sound quality, so its quite good. The only way to further improve the sound is to change the internal engine from 16 bit to 32 or 64. This change however is too much work and on top of that too complicated. (Discussed this issue a few times with the programmers)

So even though we can argue about it, its most likelly not gonna change real soon, but then again. The quality of MPT as it is now, is quite good.

32 bit can be archieved using VSTi's and leave samples unharmed, as the VST engine is 32 bit.

Huh? Olivier always praised ModPlug for having an internal 32bit engine! It was 32bit from the beginning...!

Sampleplaying is 16 bits, according to Rewbs. I'm sure as he works with the code mostly, he probably knows best.