Tips on percussion ...

[Zill]

I'm very new to the tracking scene and I've fallen quite in love with ModPlug after playing with it for a few months.

I have a question, if it's alright. :?
Basically, my forte is creating tunes and hooks and, basically the melodic part.
But one thing I can't grasp in ModPlug is the arrangement of percussion.

How do you guys make music that fits the percussion samples so well? How do you align the music properly with the beat?
Especially if the beat is a single looping sample.

That's my problem, I make the tunes just fine but I always have tons of trouble getting the tunes to match up with the beat.
I'll start out with a tune, and then by the time I add a beat sample to it I have to re-arrange my tune until it matches with the beat, which takes forever because there's no way to tell where the upbeat and the downbeat are so I can't discern where to arrange the tune.

Is using a single looping sample of a beat a bad idea in this case?

Any advice is well appreciated.
Thanks!  

[speed-goddamn-focus]

Perhaps you could try making a few songs starting with the beat, or at least use simple beat as a click-track or metronome or whatever when you make your melodies?

[LPChip]

Indeed, in this case, its important to know where the beat will be before basing your song on it.

Especially when you're going to work with longer samples like a drum loop sample.

In such cases, its very important to make sure that the drumloop sample is being played in an equal amount of rows (depending on the length, 16,32 or 64 rows.)

So before you start a new song, play your drumloop at the right key (eg. C-4) and then set your song's speed so that it matches either 16 rows, or 32 or 64 or more, depending on how much space you want and how many beats that drumloop has.

You can then use the row-hilighting to see how your song will do. In fact, you can also add the drumloop to your song at this stage, and mute the channel if desired.

[Zill]

Alright, awesome.
Thanks for the help, it definitely makes more sense now.

I can't believe I didn't think of adding the beat FIRST.

Thanks again!

[Reenen]

Doesn't the colors hi-lite every Xth row?  (In my case every 4 rows, and then a different hi-lite every 16th row)

I then set the pace so that every 16 rows equals one beat.  And 4 therefor 1 quarter note.

(obviously you run into trouble when you want to go quicker than 16th's of a note).

[LPChip]

Doesn't the colors hi-lite every Xth row?  (In my case every 4 rows, and then a different hi-lite every 16th row)

I then set the pace so that every 16 rows equals one beat.  And 4 therefor 1 quarter note.

(obviously you run into trouble when you want to go quicker than 16th's of a note).

Yeah, and thats basically what I said

[Sam_Zen]

Welcome aboard.
A couple of questions in one thread.. but I'll give it a try.

Basically, my forte is creating tunes and hooks and, basically the melodic part.
But one thing I can't grasp in ModPlug is the arrangement of percussion.

Wrong order in the process. Why start making the tune in some patterns, while you know, percussion will be involved ?
Because percussion is a regular thing, better start with preparing that aspect.
You can create the basic beat inside one pattern, creating divisions in the number of rows. One drum-kick sample could do the job already. Think simple mathematical first for a moment. Example (after loading the kick-sample) :

~ The default patternlength is 64 rows. Which can be divised in shorter groups of rows. Like e.g. 4 times a group of 16 rows.
~ Pattern-Tab. Make sure you have the kick sounding from the KB, and the cursor correctly on the first row.
~ Check the 'Row spacing'. Here you can choose the number of beats inside a pattern, because it means an automatic jump to the next row to enter the same keypress. So if you choose '32' you will have two kick-beats in one pattern.
~ Activate 'Edit' and press the keys until the pattern-end.
~ Adjust the speed of playback to personal taste. Save the module before going on with the composition.
~ Experiment with it. Maybe add some other percussion instrument in another channel.
The tune is still strong in your head, so it must be easy to then add it to the existing beat.
You can even choose to mute the channel with the drum-kick during the rest of the process, using it as kind of metronome.

Is using a single looping sample of a beat a bad idea in this case?

Looping some tonal samples like strings, is not much of a problem. But percussion sequences in one sample is another thing.
Not a bad idea, but a much more complicated idea. A matter of timing. There are two different playback-speeds involved :

~ The duration of the beat-sample in a loop depends on the programmed note.
~ The duration of one pattern depends on the playback speed set, which is another variable.
It's quite a job to finetune these two durations together, to get the piece going in a smooth way, without skipping sample-ends or getting a short silence in between. These things can cause 'stutters' in the beat. Example :

Take the mentioned pattern made with the kick-sample metronome, and set the kick in a loop in the sample-tab.
Play the pattern again. You'll probably hear what I mean.

EDIT Oops, I missed some replies in the meantime..

[Zill]

Wow, I learned everything I needed to learn and more from this thread.
Thanks a load!!!  :shock: