Just like the article of MilktyTracker (which has been deleted several times already) or XMPlay (which has been deleted half a year ago), the article about MODPlug is maybe going to be deleted at some point. If someone feels like saving the article about our nice tracker, can you help fixing and extending it?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ModPlug_Tracker
I read the discussion over at the talk page. I don't understand why they would want to pull the article?
Btw:
Wasn't Modplug the first Windows tracker out there? That would make a very good addition to the wiki-article if it were.
Yeah, but that's not very "notable" in the eyes of a wikipedian.
it's not up to date, but has some links and doesn't do any harm. why delete it ?
Well, if they accepted any article, Wikipedia would be really bloated. So they try to delete articles about "not so important stuff" - which openMPT really is _not_ IMO.
I guess it's the standard story Sam, the servers are not free, they needs a lot of maintenance, they are keeping only the "valuable" information. If they think something is not notable enough, they will just trash it like they did many times in the past.
Yep, I understand. If it's part of maintenance, then it's more acceptable.
Still, I would think that if any tracker should be part of Wikipedia (and why should it not?). Then Modplug Tracker is up there with FT2, Impulse Tracker Renoise and Buzz. It has been part of an important cultural movement that is every bit as important as music written by traditional bands.
At the beginning the complaint was that there wasn't 3rd party reference. After someone added reference to magazine, where Modplug Tracker was listed among the 'Top Trackers', the complaint changed to not being significant enough, along with explanation in essence that no matter how popular, it's not 'notable' if not having significant coverage.
A reference: Modplug player used in apparently notable demoparty (link (http://www.assembly.org/2006/compos/realtime/oldskool-platforms)) as a mod-competition player.
QuoteWasn't Modplug the first Windows tracker out there?
Nope. I tried Mod4Win shortly, in 3.11.. A buggy disaster.
QuoteIt has been part of an important cultural movement
You've got a strong point there. Tracking is a very specific way of composing contemporary music, with its ow rules and tools. So it definitely should stay mentioned in a Wiki.
I agree, that this article is quite outdated. The MP player is an archive thing.
And it needs more data about the developments of OMPT.
So, if someone writes some more lines on this page, it will not be wiped ?
Sam: Mod4Win is not a tracker, though.
It isn't ? Well, I tried to forget about 3.11 anyway.. :)
From what I know, it was a mod player, wasn't it? That's also what the wiki article says.
Yep, it was a player.
Maybe the cultural argument could "work" on the Wiki-people? I don't have an account over there, but someone else could perhaps mention that to them. There are still big demo-parties around where people enter compos with tracked modules.
you can edit articles and talk pages as a guest as well. that's the great thing about wikipedia. :P
It seems that a lot of trackers have been deleted on the Wiki. :( I will see if I get around to writing a comment on the talk page, defending the right for MPT to stay mentioned.
I wrote this in the talk tread, maybe it will come across as a rant, but I hope that some of the arguments will take hold on those responsible. :) Hope you guys like it as well!
In response to Marasmusine I hold the opinion, like so many others, that Modplug should definitely stay mentioned on Wikipedia. Tracking has been a veritable cultural movement when it arose and has been one of the reasons why amateurs not affording hardware / expensive sequencers could and can make music without the use of studios. In the early days of the Internet mod-musicians were often behind starting net-labels (Tokyo Dawn Records, Monotonik, etc), some of whom later started releasing mp3:s and going to full way to CD or 12 inch.
I think it is one of the historical forerunner to the indie mp3-scene of today. Where does Modplug Tracker in specific fit into this? Well, as Modplug Tracker was the first Windows tracker it introduced a whole lot of people to tracking as a specific way of composing music, people who hadn't encountered it during the DOS / Amiga days. It represented in itself a huge jump forward and should be considered one of the "big" trackers; which is still is being developed.
Concerning coverage, since it has been a sort of underground phenomena, written testimonies (or a lack thereof) does not equal it's importance. Also worthy mentioning is that a strange relationship has existed between trackers / hobbyists and producers who could afford more expensive tools. Resulting in a historical antagonism where trackers efforts have been sort of diminished, even when tracker-musicians put out material published by labels pressing vinyl or CD. This can explain why there exists too little information out there from "mainstream sources". Some musical magazines back in the days tended to not take tracking seriously. It sort of belonged in the "computer nerd" camp, according to some. And of course a lot of computer enthusiasts were also trackers... Anyway: this antagonism seems almost gone today, thank goodness, and there now exist several affordable solutions to the hobbyists sitting alongside of the trackers as options for a person who wants to bring out his or hers inner musician.
I realize that this has been a long reply. I hope the Wikipedia keeps this article. It is not "just" another program among many programs. It has an important part in the history of electronic "folk music", if I dare say so. A whole lot of people started out writing music in trackers, and Modplug Tracker is one of the key players in the field even as of today. Some of us also prefer to stick with it.
Have a nice day:
/ Robert Halvarsson
Well done, maleek
One could add a list of some artists that have used it, as well as some games, there are a few if memory serves. I can't edit on Wikipedia EVER for some damn reason...someone on a similar IP was banned and they never released it for me.
One could also include how it was used in the demoscene and include links to all that craziness. The article just needs a bit more data and links to other topics of a larger scale.
All the argumentation so far, is a little bit too much 'has been'. So I like to emphasize the 'still is' factor.
I don't know how to talk Wiki, but if so, I would add some story like this :
-- As a composer of modern electronic sound-art I started using ModPlug Tracker as soon as the PC became a new toolbox, by composing trackers. And I still use it, because since it has become a open source project, it has a steady line of improvement and quality. OMPT has become more flexible and well-tuned, not only as a tool to make compositions. I also use it as a complex pattern generator, or to play a tracker module live, as an instrument.
You can simply go to the wiki article and follow the "discussion" link. there, you can add your own contributions to the discussion.
I like your contribution Sam Zen. It definitely should be on the Wiki.
I agree with Zen. Even more than tracking, i use MPT for rough sequencing and even mixing. If i had the money i would have a studio with mikes, guitar pedals, a drumset, a grand mixing board, and synths all over the place. But instead i have open MPT, a multitude of VSTis, and a few talented friends with their own instruments who see music as art rather than a commercial venture. And i'm sure many of you have heard what we've produced. 8)
Not only THAT, but i have a nice little community of faceless colleagues to bounce off ideas, share our music, and feel like we're doing something worthwhile. Wouldn't have that without this little FREE app! :wink: