I switch from win to linux, and I want to use ModPlug Tracker. I run it in Wine (it opens windows aplications on linux) and it works, but without sound (error: cannot open sound device or something like that). Is there some good tracker for linux? Or are there some plans to write ModPlug Tracker for Linux?
i open modplug again and this time sound is ok :)
That's great! What distribution of Linux do you use? :) I'm sitting in front of Ubuntu right now myself ;)
I tried OMPT 1.17.02.54 in WINE on Slackware64. However, the higher keys have lower octaves than the lower keys, and sometimes when I press a key it will play a note from one octave, and sometimes a note about one octave off. Anyone else having problems? Is there any native GNU/Linux version planned? If SDL or something was used, OMPT could compile on Windows, GNU/Linux, and probably MacOS, but using SDL might take a lot of reworking.
Quote from: "darwin"I tried OMPT 1.17.02.54 in WINE on Slackware64. However, the higher keys have lower octaves than the lower keys, and sometimes when I press a key it will play a note from one octave, and sometimes a note about one octave off. Anyone else having problems? Is there any native GNU/Linux version planned? If SDL or something was used, OMPT could compile on Windows, GNU/Linux, and probably MacOS, but using SDL might take a lot of reworking.
This actually sounds like normal behavior. Please refer to your keyboard layout in the setup screen to see what each key does. I'm sure you've pressed the change octave key or changed it using your mouse.
Also, there are other keyboard preset files. You might feel more comfortable using another one. I for once use the IT keys, which use a piano kind of layout.
QuoteIf SDL or something was used, OMPT could compile on Windows, GNU/Linux, and probably MacOS, but using SDL might take a lot of reworking.
You are a "bit" narrowminded here. Think again what makes OpenMPT what it is. Right, the window toolkit. In inOpenMPT's case, this is Microsoft's proprietary MFC. Now don't tell me SDL is also a window toolkit! SDL could be used for the audio output of course, but one wouldn't even need it for that (and just using SDL would be lame, because ASIO would not be possible anymore then).
Quote from: "LPChip"[...]Also, there are other keyboard preset files. You might feel more comfortable using another one.[...]
Ok, where do I get these?
Quote from: "Jojo"[...]Think again what makes OpenMPT what it is.[...] Now don't tell me SDL is also a window toolkit![...]
Ok; a friend who is a better programmer than me just said you could use SDL to make something for Windows, MacOS, and GNU/Linux. Maybe more is necessary. I think the sound algorithms are what really make OMPT what it is.
There are a lot of trackers that are for linux.
http://beast.gtk.org
http://www.soundtracker.org/
http://cheesetracker.sourceforge.net/
http://www.milkytracker.net/
Why would you need ASIO in LInux when you have JACK?
Quote from: "Louigi Verona"Why would you need ASIO in LInux when you have JACK?
Err, because I certainly won't drop ASIO support in favor of multi-platform support? What I meant is that replacing all the current audio code by SDL is not an option.
QuoteOk, where do I get these?
in the "extraKeymaps" folder from the official download package.
Quote
Ok; a friend who is a better programmer than me just said you could use SDL to make something for Windows, MacOS, and GNU/Linux.
That really depends on what you are doing. OpenMPT is not a game, or a completely graphical tracker like f.e. SchismTracker is, so it's completely useless.
QuoteI think the sound algorithms are what really make OMPT what it is.
No, those make libmodplug (i.e. the mod engine behind OpenMPT) what it is. And libmodplug can be used with anything, including SDL (as SchismTracker shows).
I understand that, but I am saying is that ASIO on Linux is irrelevant. Basically, a cross-platform OpenMPT is like a full rewrite, so it seems to me. It is hardwired into Windows API and Windows specific design.
Quotebut I am saying is that ASIO on Linux is irrelevant.
I know that and I never said anything else anyway.
QuoteBasically, a cross-platform OpenMPT is like a full rewrite, so it seems to me. It is hardwired into Windows API and Windows specific design.
Less then you maybe think. "Only" the interface is bound to MFC, and there's usage of the WinAPI here and there, but it should really not be too complicated to switch over to Qt, if enough people are willing to help - which is the only real constraint in my view. Apart from that, a switch would open many new possibilites, for example a sample / envelope editor based on OpenGL, which would allow a lot more flexibility.
I'm not saying it's a trivial task, but there are enough helper classes to make the transition a bit easier.
How about jumping from MFC to WPF, I know Buzz is using it. And with mono you'll get linux support.
WPF = (http://www.planet-smilies.de/a_smilies/wuerger_3.gif)
Why would changing to yet another propriety and slow, Windows-only window framework be of any help? (Not to neglect that it would be as much work as converting everything to Qt.) Have you thought what additional dependencies a change to .Net would bring?
Modplug was made for windows, I don't see why changing to a more modern and flexible user interface would do so much harm. Also I'm not so sure qt is so fast as you want it to be.
QuoteModplug was made for windows
Says the Windows users. It almost sounds like you don't
want to have Modplug on other platforms, while that is one of the most important steps for me in future development.
QuoteI don't see why changing to a more modern and flexible user interface would do so much harm. Also I'm not so sure qt is so fast as you want it to be.
WPF
is slow. WPF is only official supported on Windows (since .NET is not official supported on any non-M$ product). WPF relies on DirectX.
Qt on the other hand is supported on a wide variety of platforms, does not need .Net (thus, modplug does not need to be ported to .Net) and has multimedia extensions like OpenGL (which I would make use of instantly).
Im not telling you to use wpf, but it is a great tool for designing UI. Today wine has support for direct3d. And with mono you can compile for mac and linux. But a big minus is that .net framework doesn't support windows 2000.
But reading more about qt, I'm more convinced about qt with its integration in VS2008 and speed and multithread support. But have you also looked at gtk and xwidgets?
GTK on Windows is... so-so. It might be faster on Gnome-based systems, but Qt has a lot better, native looking integration on most platforms (f.e. it does not come with a bad-looking file selection dialog like GTK has it). Apart from that, nothing has been decided yet, but it will most likely be Qt.
QuoteBut a big minus is that .net framework doesn't support windows 2000.
Actually, early versions supported W2k, afaik. But I know that there are still quite a few people out there using ModPlug on old systems, and I would not want to cut off support for those that way.
QuoteToday wine has support for direct3d.
Yeah, but I personally find D3D a lot more difficult to get into than OpenGL. That's just a personal preference, but so is Qt and I guess in the end it matters what the developer(s) like(s), and that's OpenGL in my case.
Quote from: "Jojo"
Less then you maybe think. "Only" the interface is bound to MFC, and there's usage of the WinAPI here and there, but it should really not be too complicated to switch over to Qt, if enough people are willing to help - which is the only real constraint in my view. Apart from that, a switch would open many new possibilites, for example a sample / envelope editor based on OpenGL, which would allow a lot more flexibility.
I'm not saying it's a trivial task, but there are enough helper classes to make the transition a bit easier.
Good to know!
Well, maybe in the future MPT will make it to Linux. I would certainly favour that a lot. With Renoise being proprietary, there are not many sophisticated trackers for the platform.
Quote from: "Jojo"[...]Less then you maybe think. "Only" the interface is bound to MFC, and there's usage of the WinAPI here and there, but it should really not be too complicated to switch over to Qt, if enough people are willing to help - which is the only real constraint in my view. Apart from that, a switch would open many new possibilites, for example a sample / envelope editor based on OpenGL, which would allow a lot more flexibility.
I'm not saying it's a trivial task, but there are enough helper classes to make the transition a bit easier.
Since the days of FT][ I always wanted to work on a tracker, but the death of DOS and the wider acceptance of computers with windowing environments decreased my interest in programming and I broadened my studies to the rest of the field of math. Now I forgot almost everything I know about programming, and though in the last few years I may have done intermediate OOP, I did not really get into any OOP language as deep as I should have because for a while I wanted to learn what I had missed of C. What would I have to do to be able to work on OMPT? I forgot what language it is in, but besides my first learning language I have used x86 asm, C, C++, Java, C# and a little various scripting.
If recall correctly Modplug is made of mostly c++ and some asm.
Well, the asm code is uninteresting for now - first think about getting rid of MFC, then getting rid of Windows, and then getting rid of the x86 platform is a good idea (but it will take a long time :P). The biggest part of MPT is written in C++, most parts of it are object oriented (though, due to its age, you might feel comfortable with some parts, which are still from the old DOS days...).
Quote from: "darwin"What would I have to do to be able to work on OMPT?
A less ambitious alternative to getting rid of MFC, Windows and x86 is getting Visual Studio(C++) 2003 or later.
I was watching a video on a norwegian tech-news page where the community manager of QT was presenting some features from QT. But got to know that QT has it's own framework for people who wants to migrate from mfc/win32 to QT. I hope this will be of some interest for the developers.
http://qt.nokia.com/products/appdev/add-on-products/catalog/4/Windows/qtwinmigrate/
And for those who understand norwegian, here is the video.
http://www.digi.no/837724/hva-er-egentlig-qt
Yeah, I'm aware of the migration framework, and I guess we will use this. :)
By the way OpenMPT works successfully on ReactOS's Arwinss builds now. I've been able to run some VSTi's, but sound support is poor so i couldnt test it.
Can the source code build without the UI itself? Or is OpenMPT's logic code totally integrated into the UI code?
If you compile OpenMPT without the UI, you get libmodplug. Apart from that, please define "logic code".
Quote from: "Sir Gallantmon"Can the source code build without the UI itself? Or is OpenMPT's logic code totally integrated into the UI code?
Source can't be build without the UI. Soundlib and UI are somewhat separate parts, but most of the editing code is integrated in the methods of UI classes.
A program without a user interface (UI) would not be much of a program. All programs that I know of have a user interface, but many programs anymore have a graphical user interface (GUI) (as opposed to a text driven one or perhaps even a mouse driven one).
Yeah, without the UI code, it's simply a library for playing back modules, which is happened to be called libmodplug. :P
To avoid misunderstanding:
OpenMPTs playback engine and libmodplug (http://sourceforge.net/projects/modplug-xmms/)(or this libmodplug (http://sourceforge.net/projects/libmodplug/)) are not the same, although they do have a lot of identical code.
Well, let's put it like this: They're both based on the original modplug code, however libmodplug is maintined by different people and doesn't offer all of the features OpenMPT offers (for example MPTM, VST, etc...) - apart from that, it's almost the same thing.
So, has any work been done on making the Qt based GUI?
No.