ModPlug Central

When you browse the web, which browser do you do it in?

This topic is NOT intended to be a browser war. So don't even start to disgrace other browsers.

lol, no point in actual war anyway, everybody has his own profile and made the choice long long time ago.

Anyway, i am using FF as a main browser, but im following closely all the other one's progresses, playing with them from time to time.

Chrome soon will be definitely a very strong browser, i mean it is getting there very fast on charts. Now it has extensions support, has minimalistic appealing design, it's fast and its modular, also has many tricks to make your browsing experience smooth as possible. Thanks to all this, its rock stable. Google is listening to his user requests and trying to please them. I am using the Chromium nightly builds, they are awesome. Google surely knows what is he doing.

Opera has revisited his design and made further speed optimizations lately (as the other browsers are pushing this constantly also). Not much change from his politics, it tries to tell the user how should he use the net with the integrated presetted stuff (similar to IE), not really interested about the users opinion, what would we want. But it is a very good choice for those type of users who are fine with that, and dont wana bitch with extension searching and "browser building" sessions. Simply install it, and you will get "out from the box" the most stuff that the average modern surfer person would need.

IE 9 will have some hardware 2D and 3D acceleration implemented (the other browsers will surely have it too), but it will stay on the bottom list, at least it is compatible with the standards somehow better than the previous ones.

FF is the open source, user friendly powerhouse. It has a tons of different interesting builds, it has the most largest and easy manageable extension database, tons of great stuff. There is nothing what you cant build or customize with the extensions. Imagine something that you want, and you already has an extension for it, just need to download and set it up. It has very large fanbase thanks to this, many peoples are constantly developing and upgrading the plugs. The latest nightly build are testing a new multi-threading engine, that will allow to run most parts of the page and the plugins in separate threads, so they wont slow down your browser even with multiple fast tab or link openings, and if some element crashes (crappy adobe flash codes on random pages anyone? :D) only the plugin thread will "die" (and can be restarted), the whole page, the other tabs will stay intact. Also the nightly has already hw acceleration implemented, cosmetic changes and great speed improvements.

Besides the nightly "Minefield" build I am using a third party "branch", called Palemoon, the cool stuff about it, that is totally optimized for modern machines and processors, also has interesting memory usage and other minor optimizations.
http://www.palemoon.org/

It's a problem with the pole when you can only select one the alternatives.

Here is what I use:
Chrome/IE/Opera Mini.

Quote from: "Rakib"It's a problem with the pole when you can only select one the alternatives.

Here is what I use:
Chrome/IE/Opera Mini.

I'm sure you use one of these for main browsing. I suspect that would be Chrome?

IE probably at work, Opera Mini on the phone, right?

If I could allow multiple choices in the poll, I would. But phpBB doesn't support that.

May I ask what version of IE you're using?

Right on the spot  :D Guessing you can check ip-adresses?

But we have IE8 here, but I'm looking forward to IE9.

Quote from: "Rakib"Right on the spot  :D Guessing you can check ip-adresses?

But we have IE8 here, but I'm looking forward to IE9.

I do not need to check an IP adres to make a guess like this.

Here's my reasoning:

Opera-mini is a known browser for phones, so it was easy to link it to your phone.

If you would use IE as main browser, you wouldn't need Chrome.

If you only use Chrome, you would not use IE, so you must be using IE at a place where Chrome is not supported or allowed. Work or I-net cafe would be the location, but since work is the most common place where I would find this, it was my first guess. :)

I happen to have the same situation. I use Opera at home, IE7 at work (though I have a portable FireFox installation there too, but shh... :P) and IE8 at home for testing mostly. Opera-mini on the phone of course :)

Quote(though I have a portable FireFox installation there too, but shh... :P)

naughty, naughty LP. :D

Aaaand, it's still called Firefox, not FireFox.:P (also, the official abbreveration is not FF, but Fx). Oh, and Firefox rules of course.

FF is more easier to write, and most of the people who i know is using this way... so i think ill stick with it. :D But your right.

ff doesn't rule, pfff.. it is, at the best, the less of the 3 evils. it has been known to leak memory since v1.5.
some say it's a matter of updating the java version, some say it's avg clocking up ff, and so and so on..
if you start a search about "firefore memory leak" you'll find pages and pages of fixes, patches, suggestions
and such, but it'd appear that what works for one, doesn't for another.

now, as i've said at first, ff is not the worst of all, it has ups and downs, just like ie, opera and chrome.
i use the first 3 (ff 3.08/ie 6.02/opera 10.51), for different usages, on 2 different machines.

i won't go into chrome, simply because it's a bigbrother product, but it seems to have been developed by true web users..

Do I have to remind everyone, this topic is not a browser war? ;)

Quote from: "LPChip"This topic is NOT intended to be a browser war. So don't even start to disgrace other browsers.

Quote from: "AlisterFlint"it has been known to leak memory since v1.5.

you must be one of the people who are using weird extensions. with the extensions I use, it has NEVER "leaked" memory, meaning that it's staying at stable 100-200mb RAM usage (depending on how many sites I have opened), no matter for how many hours or even days I let it run.

I use FF for main browsing. At work I also need to use Chrome.

Opera, Chrome, Safari, IE7. I like Opera the most for it's simplicity and great ad-blocking.

If people are worried about issues with chrome we have Iron, which is the same code but doesn't have the home-calling feature.

why isn't Netscape Communicator 4.8 on the poll list?

Well, I used to browse with IE7 but I simply hate it. Feels like naked, and since the last three~ years, I was changed to Firefox (with Ad Block Plus and NoScript), it's more stable, and when it hangs, just a click in the close button, and closes. The others of my family also use it. The best for me.

Quote from: "uncloned"why isn't Netscape Communicator 4.8 on the poll list?

You're right. Netscape 4.x should be there if there's also Internet Explorer 6.

Sorry... Seems I forgot 2. Safari and Netscape. Both added now.

Do note that even the authors of Netscape have given up on Netscape itself since their Mozilla branch went so well.

and also focused on more business-oriented apps, such as ldap..

Quote from: "Jojo"

Quote from: "AlisterFlint"it has been known to leak memory since v1.5.

you must be one of the people who are using weird extensions. with the extensions I use, it has NEVER "leaked" memory, meaning that it's staying at stable 100-200mb RAM usage (depending on how many sites I have opened), no matter for how many hours or even days I let it run.

blah blah blah, you're really a champ, no doubt :)

millions of people are using it, yet you can always find some dudes who are mysteriously having "memory leaks" and "freeze ups" with it. I would check the extensions, avir programs or other stuffs that could interfere with it, coz me, nor my friends that i know aren't having any troubles with FF whatsoever. I think it would be a really big and general trouble for EVERY user, if there would be any nasty memory leak on the FF builds, you would surely heard from it on most news channels.

You can write opera memory leaks and internet explorer memory leaks and find dozens of "reports" too, yet they work fine on my comp too. Mostly on these cases are the user, who did something wrong, not the browser's fault.

I did a very non-scientific research, googling for browser name and memory leaks and then divided the result with the market share according to some wikipedia article. These are the results, pointless but interesting from a flame point of view:

google search                     hits per % of market
------------------------------------------------------
opera memory leaks              -   94 416
internet explorer memory leaks  -   10 341
firefox memory leaks            -  709 945
chrome memory leaks             -   24 142

I use firefox (with adblock, fireFTP and flashgot). At some point I used epiphany wich is light and fast and has adblock and a couple of extensions.
Linux browsers all have the same problem of not being able to smooth images when zooming in pages (I don't know why all is so tiny on most webpages).

actually, firefox 3.x+ should interpolate images when zooming on all platforms. and since many linux browsers are based on the gecko rendering engine... well... most of them should zoom in similar manner.

Google Chrome Speed Tests
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nCgQDjiotG0
i've lolled.

I voted Chome, but I also use Firefox. I keep a session in Firefox so that it's always open with my news feeds, and use Chrome for the rest.

Quote from: "Rakib"If people are worried about issues with chrome we have Iron, which is the same code but doesn't have the home-calling feature.

Home calling feature?

Google wants all your data, even the data in your browser. They have removed the unique ID from the browser that was set once and forever when installing it, but I guess that they still have a way to track users. There's no reason to use Chrome, really, because there's Iron, which is built upon the same codebase (Chromium), but without the user tracking crap.

Whoa your right, Google want to spy our arses off and kill 95% of the human population. O_O
They must do, coz has closed source codes...just like ie, windows, apple, opera or safari and a tons of other companies too.

Chromium and the rest are build on open source codes, you have the choice to use the ember online Google services, or switch them off (with chrome too). Don't we just love paranoid people? :D Surely every mega company wants to rule the world and destroy the humanity.

Sorry, but it simply true that Google loves to collect any data from every human being. This is not paranoia, it's their business - or how do you think they manage to survive in the business world with so many free programs and websites?
I agree that it's paranoia if people complain that google is scanning wireless networks while driving with their streetview cars through cities, because they use this data for position location if GSM signals are weak. However, it is not paranoia to be fully aware that google is collecting data and that there's a simple way to avoid this.

It is interesting about memory leakage. I've never experienced anything like it or else I do not know the symptoms.
On the other hand, Opera is a closed proprietary product - its code is secret and you do not know how many leaks it has. FF is stable enough for me and any problems it has are being solved rapidly.

Quote from: "Jojo"how do you think they manage to survive in the business world with so many free programs and websites?

different business model than the rest. In a nutshell they based it on the ads.
Google gain founds from the companies and not from the users. They gather the users, offering free services that are mostly the best in the world, i am using many of them too. They dont care about any of your private information, like how did you shot your puppy last year or how cool you had modded your PC case, or anything similar. They gather informations about the way how you use their online services, so they can make it even better for the users (included you), so it will appear to more and more people. This way more and more companies will be interested to advertise their product with them, because of their large user base. Its a win-win business model for everyone, users will get the most professional and superb online services for free, with constant updates and fine tunings for their demand, and the advertising companies will get larger and larger potential costumer base. Google are getting large profit this way too, and will have the inspiration to continue inventing new services and keep up the good work with the old ones. And no, they aren't giving any of the gathered information to third parties (or in some cases, they make it accessible to anyone who likes to check them, like several statistic in youtube or similar services), because if they would do, it would mean disrespect to the users who trust them with it, and they would massively leave Google. They arent stupid and they are playing their cards right so far.

Ok, apparently you don't know how advertising works. What would AdSense be worth if it only displayed Barbie or Bathroom equipment to you? You would not click any ads of course. However, they do track your google searches and similar stuff to find out what you are interested in, so they can automatically create a detailed user profile of you and rather display ads for this hot new sample collection instead. Improving their own services based on this data is a minor issue of theirs. Sorry for trying to burst your bubble, but this is simply how it works, and if you're fine with what they do, I don't mind.

What's troubling me most about google is that they not only provide the best online services for free but they also control it. Blogs have been shut down, videos are removed all the time, view counters are manipulated... Every one likes and use google, it's great but they can pull the plug anytime.

Quote from: "Jojo"Ok, apparently you don't know how advertising works. What would AdSense be worth if it only displayed Barbie or Bathroom equipment to you? You would not click any ads of course. However, they do track your google searches and similar stuff to find out what you are interested in, so they can automatically create a detailed user profile of you and rather display ads for this hot new sample collection instead. Improving their own services based on this data is a minor issue of theirs.

Actually im very much aware of this, and didnt said other way. Of course they would improve their ad system, their primary source of founds. My point was that they never give personal information out to third parties, and only collecting data about their services, to improve them.

Quote from: "Jojo"Sorry for trying to burst your bubble, but this is simply how it works, and if you're fine with what they do, I don't mind.

And why would anybody not be fine with this? I mean sure, everyone is much more pleased to see Barbie, Bathroom, Viagra, Denis enlarger or related ads all over the free pages they browse right?. To be honest, if we're talking about choice (of having awesome free sites and awesome free online services, with ads, to support their existence), i would like to see stuff that i care about, and would maybe actually buy, and im sure every sane person thinks the same way, rather than having totally unrelated crap all over my face. Yet again win-win situation, the user is happy to actually have related and interesting ads, and the companies are happy, coz they have more potential costumers.

With one of the new services, they can even personalize the search hits for every single user who has google account, so the more you search for similar stuff and make a certain choices of sites, the search results will more and more change, to suit your needs better (which you can turn off again if you chose that way). I am using it of course, much more accurate hits for my terms, based on my personal logic, and can find that im looking for much faster.

Of course, you can always chose to stay away totally from the ads, and have every significant site, online services user supported by monthly subscriptions from your personal pocket or similar models, but thank you, i will stay with Google's free business model. What they do is much more profitable and providential for everyone, no matter that you are the service user, or the investing company.

Quote from: "Paul Legovitch"What's troubling me most about google is that they not only provide the best online services for free but they also control it. Blogs have been shut down, videos are removed all the time, view counters are manipulated... Every one likes and use google, it's great but they can pull the plug anytime.

They can of course. But its their best interest to continue pleasing everyone as long as they can, because its a constant base of founds for them. They based their entire business around this. So they definitely dont have any sane reasons to kill themselves, and if they would go insane at one point and do, you can just use any other service again, or build your own.

But with this logic any other companies could go insane at any point, microsoft could stop supporting and selling windows, blocking almost the entire IT infrastructure,  linux developers could go closed source and sell their OS, etc etc. But as i've said, Google based their entire business model of doing what they do, and as far as i can see they are very sane people, so they should be staying with us for quite some time.

I use SeaMonkey (2.0) for all my tasks!

I was surprised to see the firefox/seamonkey since even if they share a lot of the code SeaMonkey is a quite a bit different from Firefox! SeaMonkey is imho a more competent browser (standalone) in addition to all the tools from the suite.

anywa... I also use IE at work mainly because stupid programmers mostly use frameworks for windows and rely on non-standard things. e.g. they don't care about writing something that works on standard browsers as long as it works in ie... and not they are going for a sliverlight as well... bah - horribe even if it fixes a few issues. Basing things on plugins are never a good idea - it's better to improve the web standards!

QuoteSeaMonkey is imho a more competent browser

That can be true. Actually ff isnt trying to be a "complete" all around solution at all, but giving the generic basics that one would need, and letting him build the rest on his own (like a custom build pc). Endless possibilities for customization, what is making it so enjoyable for the users, they will build their own complete browser.

Quoteit's better to improve the web standards!

well yea...but when you have shitty ones and everyone is pushing their own "standards", we hafta use embracing "third party standards" like flash, that looks and works the same on every cross platform. :/

Quote from: "psishock"we hafta use embracing "third party standards" like flash, that looks and works the same on every cross platform. :/

...or does not work at all or not properly, like for example on 64-bit linux. on the linux terminals at university, red and blue channels are swapped for every flash file, and that does not look very pretty. :P

lol well yea, they are wurrkin on it to support more and more platforms i guess, but the idealistic idea is there. :D Its strange, i have no troubles with flash and ff on latest ubuntu here at home. Maybe you have some interesting linux builds on university?

On Ubuntu x64, I don't have Flash at all, and I think the x64 vs Linux problem is a general issue.

oh, right, i have the x86 version installed on virtual machine. Well the whole migration thingy to x64 systems goes full of lil issues, but we will be eventually there. I think we should be able to switch completely, feel totally safe'n comfortable max after a year or two for sure. (Windows 7 was the last mixed x64/x86 release, the next versions will be only x64, and that will push everything to that direction lightning fast anyway)

If Adobe cares about Linux at all. I bet they still don't have a proper x64 version of Flash in a year, I tell you. The stuff that's running on the servers at uni is most likely an early beta version, not available to normal x64 linux users.

QuoteIf Adobe cares about Linux at all.

well most of the companies (and users) arent give a damn about linux anyway... so its general behavior, not Adobe exclusive.

True. Doesn't mean that they're doing it right, though.

It's their personal choice to do so, everyone has their own reasons :D. Well its kinda a vicious circle if you think about it, the companies dont care about it, cos the user base is weak, and so is the business model possibilities. The users dont care because they dont have support from the companies they like and work with. Also the free offers are no way that can keep up with the payed developments and products, so mostly those are not appealing to general users as well.

But here comes Google with free services that are professional in quality, because are made with interesting business model, that pays off really well to developers to develop. :D

Im totally curious how will this linux based Google OS/android pull of in longer terms. So far it starts really great, it looks professional and people are liking, using it more and more. Google has the power to popularize linux and pull companies and users to it too.

Quote from: "Louigi Verona"On the other hand, Opera is a closed proprietary product - its code is secret and you do not know how many leaks it has.

On the third hand, it's hard not to notice if there are serious cases of memory leakage.